It's too damn expensive, full stop. Given your appreciation of the Pacific Microsonics DAC, I hope you'll get a chance to hear the Berkeley in your system as well. November 11, 2020 in Digital Sources, DACs, and Computer Audio. as far as direct comparison with other dacs the closest Ive done is listening to the Select II at shows and then listening to other top dacs in other systems at shows. Dealer's should be required to state they're a dealer every time they post or have a disclaimer in their username. You'll be shocked by how much you lose by going through a separate preamp. But in the specific case of the BADA and PM2, if you wish for me to be more precise, then taking into account that I only had the BADA ref for a very short time, the bottom line was that I didn't feel at the time that the difference between the PM2 in my system was significant enough to make it worth the energy to change components or the potential financial loss involved in a trade. By clicking links on our site, we may earn affiliate commission, but our editorial remains entirely independent and unbiased. In terms of sound quality, it's the best digital front end I . If you currently have an MSB DAC or amplifier that you lovebut are looking to experience more from your systemplease reach out to your local dealer. I don't like Dave with or without upsampler but I do like Auralic G2 with their upsampler and clock. The more observant of you will have read this and noticed that there is no mains inlet. Thank you, Mike. There are some tonal differences too, but what you prefer will depend on your other equipment and the music you like. which make some people prefer this one to MSB Select II Point 85 Chord Dave and Mscaler (or Blue II transport) This one give transparent and 3D soundstage with excellent details. The SQ is amazingly good. It is bested easily by DACs at $150. Dave Chord Dac Vs Discrete Msb - 111.toptrans.milano.it Audiogon Discussion Forum I may need to reset expectations a bit lower: This is an update to some old DAVE vibration control posts. They both use FPGA for their decoding. There are separate optimal PCM and DSD modes for playbacks and bit perfect playback is how DAVE performs optimally as the FPGA up samples and noise shapes everything to 104MHz 5-bit. this was how I originally decided to purchase the Select II as I was trying to hear another dac at shows that could do what I heard the Select II doing at a lower price. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $14,000. Chord DAVE - DAC - Digital to Analog Conversion - Audiophile Style JavaScript is disabled. Elevator Pitch Review: Built in America, the MSB Discrete is a modular DAC that also acts as a preamplfier, though, as supplied, it has no analogue inputs. I have heard a lot of top DACs at shows or other systems but not in my own. So yes it's a question of being polite, but it's also about acknowledging the limitations inherent in making absolute pronouncements about differences between high performing components. digital front ends. I agree price is necessarily indicative of quality or performance. While were committed to long lasting products that hold their value, we realize audio systems are always evolving. You must log in or register to reply here. I agree with what you are saying but "far too often" the The only true way for the end user to know what they prefer is through listening in their own system.. Thanks for the interesting reply, cmarin. the Select II pushes the analog to be its best. Pass Labs INT-60. had if for 2 years now. I'm looking for suggestions on DACs I should listen to as possible replacement of my Chord Dave. The reasoning behind the two clocks dealing with different frequency families is that music is mostly recorded within multiples of the 44.1kHz family or the 48kHz family and having a clock dealing with each family minimises loss. The Premier DAC Features - MSB Technology Stuart Smith finds out. I have heard the Dave and EMM Labs DAC2x up against aMakua that I subsequently purchased. luxury apartment hotels paris. Bespoke Audio Ultimate Silver TVC passive preamp, Totaldac xlr version D1-Drivers x2, Eisteddfod 340 & 840 amps, Magico S5 speaker, MSB Select DAC, MSB Select Transport, Nakamichi 700 XLE cassette deck, Taiko Audio Extreme Server, Tripoint Troy Signature NG groundbox, PLiXiR Elite 1500 isolation transformers. Thats not allthe CNC unibody aluminum chassis provides the discrete power supply with optimal thermal performance and an elegant design aesthetic. With two prime DACs, we yield an unprecedented level of detail, reproducing the musicality, soundstage, and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. I found it big bold brash and dynamic but hard cold glary and fatiguing - all the old fashioned things I hated about early digital. My first serious audio system was Garrard turntable, Fisher Int(SS), ADS bookspeaker bought on 1978. I've had some excellent preamps in my system (Dartzeel, Absolare, Robert Koda, Kondo). The other stand out dacs that we like are the It's embarrassing. Roon Endpoint This hobby is "highly subjective", influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions; therefore you can A/B a million different components and come to a completely different conclusion on how it sounds compared to another listener. Very resolving, tone is on the cold side of neutral but otherwise pretty free of digital nasties compared to the cheaper Chords, and the stage is flatter than Keira Knightley. Thanks. Cs | Critical Mass CS2s -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers + subs | Adona Eris II rack on Herbie's titanium footers | Fully treated and dedicated 2 channel room. The PSUs are available to match. So I saw the DAC lighting up and it looked fully functional, right down displaying the bit rate etc of the file playing, but no music. They are excellent pairing. I hear the new Ayre QX-5 Twenty gives the DAVE a run for its money at $8950 but that is just hearsay. There is no dark magic involved. Didn't like it at all. Both DACs connected directly to power amp using each DACs volume controle. See what the reviews are saying. Then we have the Integrated Clock module and Im starting to get the whole modular approach to the design of the MSB DAC. Jon Hopkins Music For Psychedelic Therapy was a beautifully enveloping experience, made all the more so as sounds come and go in the soundstage in a somewhat more solid way than without the usual DAC. You already have a very top tier DAC. state his/her experience and preferences. It is not hard to audition these DACs in Melbourneand this is your best way to work out your own preference. Some silly sausage plugged a white power cable into a black device. When connecting to the MScaler, Dual-BNC was used on the chord dacs with shawline digital BNC cables. - Up to 32 bit - 768kHz. You absolutely can say that you prefer other DAC's to the Berkeley Alpha Reference. Each clock is made up of two independent clocks but only one is used at any given time so as not to add unwanted noise to the circuit. and this is borne out in the sound that this DAC brings to the party. CH Precision C1 DAC. By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies. definitely up there with the best dacs in the world. The video cannot be shown. Now to include the HMS. If you go reference you will never look back. Mola Mola Pre/dac review compared to DAVE dac - Page 2 - DAC - Digital I'm not an absolutist, and frankly, I could be happy with any of the DACs I mentioned. How is Chord Dave? | Super Best Audio Friends There are some tonal differences too, but what you prefer will depend on your other equipment and the music you like. When you get the chance to hear Chord DAVE, try playing files bit perfect instead of upsampling them to DSD256 with HQPlayer. Were constantly improving digital input modules to stay at the forefront of the high-end audio industry, ensuring youre always equipped with the most current digital file formats and interfaces. Directstream, Bricasti M1, Jeff Rowland Aeris, Chord Dave, and today I I cant help with comparisons of two of these DACs, but I did hear the Tambaqui up against the dCS Bartok and it was a pretty close call, but ultimately the dCS sounded more analogue and more immersive, I have heard the Dave and EMM Labs DAC2x up against aMakua that I subsequently purchased. The MSB simply sounded more real to my ears and offered a more convincing soundstage and tonality and all the tiny informations in the music where integrated in the musical flow whereas the DAVE simply sounded flat and not realistic to my ears and even lacked those tiny informations. As the topic suggests, looking for comparisons on the above Dacs from people who have atleast heard and compared 2 of these dacs. Besides that the MSB looks so much better. I don't understand why Chord DACs have to be so damn ugly! @shkong78 Thanks for sharing your listening impressions of the Lampizator Pacific vs the MSB DACs as well as what you miss about the Pacific vs your Chord combo. The BADA Ref is a great DAC and I understand the new version takes it to even another level. Anyway, the MSB Discrete is a machine that I consider to be highly resolving and a true HiFi product with regard to the definition I quoted above. @yyzsantabarbara, your dealer quote is interesting, I suspected that the Mola Mola was that good. Not a bad idea Snoop! In that price range, you would be mad not to add the MSB Premier DAC to your list as well. September 6, 2016 in DAC - Digital to Analog Conversion. HiFiMan Ananda, SR Orange fuses, Taiko Audio Daiza platforms, Startech FMC optical network link, Oyaide EE f/s2.0 V2 mains spurs, Akiko Audio tuning sticks, GIK Acoustic TriTraps/panels. Stainless steel buttons arrayed around an elegant volume wheel to optimize performance and response. The main reason we took on Rockna was because their So, essentially, around the back of this DAC we have XLR output modules, dual power inputs (more on this in a moment) the digital input module (XLR, RCA, and two optical), and the USB input. Anyway, the little bit of extra detail on the strings, the attack, and decay are all there to be heard and its a marvelous thing to listen to. It's better than the MSB Analog I listened to. - MQA decoding. Dave gets a "thumbs up" overall from me though. Actually the ChordHugo M Scaler and the Blu Mk. MSB Discrete DAC - What's Best Forum You are using an out of date browser. Of course your opinion on sound quality is your own, and valid, but to suggest that the reason for the difference is because the Chord is an "FPGA DAC" is technically incorrect. The MSB Discrete DAC is an American made Digital to Analogue Converter costing 11,000 plus an extra 1650 for the second external power supply. When I have done the comparison with other DACs I have had at the same time - Ayre QX5-Twenty, EAR Dac 4, exasound e32 - often the immediate impression is that DAVE/Blu 2 is not quite as good - a bit dryer sounding, not quite as smooth, not as airy or three dimensional And yet, over the longer term, it is deeply satisfying at a musical level in a way that the other DACs are not. The bottom line for me is that great DACs can make a difference over good DACs. Like a true audiophile with "issues", I'm saying to myself, if at $8300 Always use!! The only true way for the end user to know what they prefer is through listening in their own system. You could try some of the newer dacs that has gotten good reviews. The AC modules are fully balanced at every stage, have no buffers, IV converters, or transistors in the signal path, and have no active devices used in the conversion process at all. We used PCM (16/44,1 to 24/192) and DSD 64 and 128 for the comparioson. Do diamonds shine on the dark side of the moon? Mind you, I have chipless DSD with 1 bit processing, so the bar is set VERY high for me. Hope to try different formats on both DACs to see what works best in my system. An FPGA does not have analog output, in the Chord DACs, VLC | M-Audio FastTrack Pro | Mac Opt | Panasonic SA-HE100 | Logitech Z623, : SET Tube Amp | Low-Noise Linear Regulated Power Supply | USB, Power, Speaker Cables | Speaker Stands | Acoustic Panels, http://igg.me/at/geekpulseaudio/x/5216671. "To be 100% honest we have A/B tested most of the dacs mentioned This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. This all-American theme is continued in the companys PCB Shop where they use circuit boards produced for them in Silicon Valley, which are then made ready for the automated adding of the smaller components and hand-fitting bulkier components before washing and inspection. And what streamer are you using to feed the DAC? SO/ROON/HQPe: DSD 256-Sonore opticalModuleDeluxe-Signature Rendu optical--Bricasti M3 DAC--DIY Purifi Amplifier-Focus Audio FS888 speakers-JL E 112sub-Nordost Tyr USB, DIY EventHorizon AC cables, Iconoclast XLR & speaker cables, Synergistic Purple Fuses, Spacetime system clarifiers. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates. Along with an integrated clock, changing this card allows switching between single-ended and balanced outputs. Never say never, but I reckon 99.9% of folk would get to the Discretes level of performance and not be able to justify another 110K to achieve, what I am guessing would be marginal gains though I have not experienced the Select and so cannot say for sure that this would be the case and it may be a total revelation is sonic engineering. The other thing I've learned about the Chord Dave is it can sound very different depending on the interconnect and/or power cord used. home system and listening for that end result. Triangle Magellan Concerto 2< AQEverest< Vitus Audio SS-010 Mk2< AQDragon High Current< AQWELXLR< ChordQutestDAC w UpTone JS-2 & AQ Dragon Source < AQDiamond USB< InnuosPhoenix USBwAQ Dragon Source< AurenderN100H & AQ Dragon Source< NetGear GS105GESwitch w UpTone LPS1.2< Supra CAT8 Ethernet DACs Overview - MSB Technology Ill not get into the whole detail of this here but the MSB website does have an excellent (and interesting) explanation of jitter and why having a very low jitter clock is favourable to having a very accurate clock theres a link at the bottom of this review. In that price range, you would be mad not to addthe MSB Premier DAC to your list as well. MSB Technology's Discrete DAC was the best DAC I'd heard in my systemuntil the MSB Premier showed up. I have listened to MSB Analog DAC and Diamond DAC IV but not in the same setup as DAVE. As it stands, the Discrete offers a very good solution should you be a music lover that plays only digital files and you can go straight into a power amp. As you mentioned imaging better, incredible PRaT with MSB. More sharing . Daedalus Audio Apollo 11's. REL S3/SHO. Elegant yet commanding, our finishes are available in a matte silver or matte black anodize. msb discrete dac vs chord dave - 1click3d.com Links may be used, provided that full and clear credit is given to Hifi Pig and Big Pig Media with appropriate and specific direction (link) to the original content. I still did not found better audio source. @astewart8944--two years ago in Feb of 17 i did audition the original Formula dac in my system directly compared to the Lampizator GG 1.5 and the Nagra HD and preferred the Formula for its greater space, lower noise, and more neutral and fast presentation. Also, it is worth noting I heard the v1 DAC 2X, not the v2. Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers, A healthy approach to understanding measurements, After being asked for the 308th time, Merv lists top 5 headphones, $1000 to the first to design a headamp using discrete components with better measurements than Magni 3+, http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/chord-dave-29757/#post579518, (You must log in or sign up to reply here.). Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by mtoc, Jun 9, 2016. Thanks guys! MSB are an American brand headed up by the brothers Jonathan and Daniel Gullman and located in Silicon Valley, California where they design and build a range of amplifiers, transports, and DACs. We are Unauthorized use and/or duplication of this material (in part or in full) without express and written permission from this websites author and/or owner is strictly prohibited. I believe it comes down to I've sometimes heard people say that DAVE is too bright or analytical for them. Almost all gear I hear is pretty good and some are great but the most expensive ones are not universally the best to my ears. I just heard DAVE directly connected to MacBook Pro via USB without any expensive cables, headphone amplifier, power conditioner. Personally we have A/B 76 different digital front ends.. And differences at that level can be good. It seems to me that manufacturers are jacking up the price for the perception of quality. I think is a good general rule of thumb, but there are some very transparent passive pre-amps out there. and build quality is also excellent. This latter track is a good track for me to play when listening to new kit as it is basically a drum machine and an acid box and this latter did sound just like a 303 there in the room. Great Dac but for me a NOS DAC (Metrum Adagio) won the contest over all the others Dacs I have tried so far. Amplification: Cyrus Mono x300Signatures. Who knows ?! Mola Mola is another well built great sounding This is disabled if you are outputting to a preamplifier. It could sound analytical or hot coupled with bright combination of speaker and amplifier. The Premier is a super-high-resolution, completely silent, utterly dynamic component that lets music flow through it less hindered than through anything else I've heard. It would be absolute suicide for an audio distributor to Some very good advice here. While it's an easy setup to wrangle at a show, it does seem like it wasn't doing either component any favours! very important and our preference connection is an i2S connection. Once you start playing a tune the DAC works out the sample rate and chooses the correct playback clock. Of the ones you mentioned I'd be most tempted by the Emm Labs DAC 2x though if you can get a used higher-end Esoteric, you should jump on it. There is scale on bigger productions and intimacy on smaller-scale recordings and pieces, It wont make a pigs ear into a sows purse, but its majestic on really good recordings, Its very detailed but not harshly so actually, its a very easy component to fit in a system and live with, Its not cheap and you will want both PSUs once you compare with just one, No analogue inputs to make it the heart of a full system, You know that MSB have stuff that is out of reach financially and potentially better, Price: 11,000 plus 1,650 for a second power supply. But the majority of the time all 6 of The Chord Qutest DAC has the same DAC architecture and filters as the Chord Hugo 2. I'm looking for suggestions on DACs I should listen to as possible replacement of my Chord Dave. That statement makes sense in an analog paradigm. Thanks for the suggestions Wisnon. Check out our support page and technical specifications > Click Here, 10100007 - Discrete DAC with Supply- Gallery - 1200px, 10100007 - Discrete DAC with Supplies - Gallery - 1200px, 10100006 - Discrete DAC - Gallery - 1200px, 10100003 - Discrete DAC Badge - Gallery - 1200px, 10100005 - Discrete DAC MSB Logo - Gallery - 1200px, 10100004 - Discrete DAC Jack Panel - Gallery - 1200px, 10100008 - Discrete DAC Basemetal - Gallery - 1200px, 10100009 - Discrete Supply Options - Gallery - 1200px, 10100010 - Discrete Supply Cover - Gallery - 1200px. I hope to also have an opportunity to listen to a T+A DAC8 (for DSD512) and a Chord Dave (DSD256) in my system soon (with HQPlayer). As I said, its an odd one to describe but you do hear it as it brings a sense of rightness to rhythm tracks. Elegant design. It has the option for two PSUs and once you hear with both it becomes a necessity to have both. At some point you have to be content in this hobby. The Discrete DAC, The Premier DAC, The Reference DAC, The Select DAC II, Theater Master. Less experience with Dave on DSD, plus Rob claims to no longer decimate. I wired it all up and the unit lit up but I could get no sound out of it whatsoever. Once complete there are measurements and functional tests before the final products are inspected, cleaned, and packed up ready to be shipped, but not before a white glove inspection by either Jonathan or Daniel. Did you audition all of them in the same place with the same system? Guess what I am trying to say is: preamps are important. Superior conversion begins with clean and stable low-noise power. Roon/Jriver 22 -> Ayre QX-5 Twenty -> Ayre AX-5 Twenty -> B&W N802D (Transparent Cables). I believe it comes down to To me, the instrumental timbre seems more accurate with DAVE than any other DACs I've heard. It features the very best conversion technology available, using proprietary techniques never seen before, making DAVE the most advanced DAC/preamp amplifier in the world. Set up is key, cables are super important, server is also DAVE is the most advanced DAC Chord Electronics has ever made. MSBs top-level DAC is 121K and there are other brands out there offering very expensive options, but the truth is that the vast majority of people will never feel the need to spend that kind of money (even if they could) to eek out that last-minute bit of detail. Paired with performance increases, our modular design ethos increases flexibility for future updates and product support, guaranteeing a long-term product investment.